dubiously sane vampire ponderings

[ontology]

Interestingly, in all of the vampire stories I have come across, in whatever medium, none of them have ever given any thought as to why Christian symbols -- crosses, holy water, often churches themselves -- ward off vampires. To be fair I don't recall any scientific explorations of the fending-off power of garlic or silver or stakes (wooden or iron) or why vampires can't cross the threshold of a house uninvited*, either, but they don't have the same sort of -- hmm, significance. And I've never come across any stories in which a vampire recoiled from the Koran, or a Hindu idol, or the Star of David. But then there are also very few vampire stories set outside of a Western aesthetic.



* And because I think far too much, I keep thinking about how the particulars of that rule work. Vampires tend to make homes in abandoned buildings (all right, sometimes their own seemingly abandoned homes), and if the building is abandoned, does that stop the whatever-it-is that requires an invitation? What if someone's crept off the street to sleep in an abandoned building for a night, and a vampire attempts to enter? Does the building or house have to be specifically in someone's possession? And what sort of buildings can't they enter? Homes, all right, absolutely; and usually churches, too, but for different reasons. But what about businesses? If a vampire took a notion to attend the theatre, would he have to finagle some way of being invited inside? Most of the stories that mention the invitation requirement stop with houses and don't seem to give a thought to other buildings, so presumably the rules are different, but how, and why? Can vampires enter the homes of other vampires without being invited? How does one, or can one, un-invite a vampire? (When Angel went evil, they changed the locks, but I'm not sure that fits in with how I see magic, as such, working.) At what point does spending a great deal of thought on the inner workings of fictional universes border on getting one institutionalised? Is there any hope for me? Will I ever run out of question marks? Is it less mad if it can count as novel research?

Comments

[lady-moriel.livejournal.com]

Well, I'm guessing the main reason for the power of Christian symbols is that back when real vampire lore started up, not just the stuff from Dracula and onward, vampires were lumped in with werewolves, witches, demons, and so forth--evil people who'd thrown their lot in with Satan in some way or another and were given demonic powers in return. Something like that, anyway. So Christian symbols are used against them for the same reason they'd be used against, say, an actual demon.

Now, like Charis said, more modern bits of folklore have focused on the psychic defense raised by the person's faith in the symbol and not the symbol itself. Doctor Who did that--in the Seven ep "The Curse of Fenric," the bad guys are these vampire-like things called...what was it...haemovores, I think? That's how it worked with those, so different people in the ep were able to use different symbols against them, not always to pleasant effect...this priest guy held out a Bible, but they taunted him, he doubted, and they took him. A Soviet soldier got past them by holding out a pin of the Communist Party hammer and sickle because of his great faith in "the revolution." Ace held off the haemovores because of her faith in the Doctor; he, in turn, got past them by saying the names of his companions.

Since you're already going into research mode, you should definitely try reading Dracula, since it's pretty much the father of all vampire lit--actually I've an audiobook of it, unabridged, I could give you links to. I'm nowhere close to finishing it myself, but it might be good for research. You should definitely watch Moonlight, too, and read a few of The Dresden Files since he deals with vampires a lot. (Plus he makes a reference to the Evil Overlord List in Death Masks. How can I not love the guy?) Dresden deals with the whole threshold thing too, actually, and I'm trying to remember--well, of course there's stuff about that with fairies in the Artemis Fowl books, that coming into a house uninvited robs them of their magic and makes them sick, but it wasn't too specific otherwise (although Holly once tore apart a house around a bad guy to get around that rule). Anyway, Dresden...let me think...it had something to do with the energies a place collects by virtue of being a home, or something like that, and the strength of the threshold depends on how--for lack of a better word--homey the place is. Dresden's bachelor pad doesn't have a very strong threshold, for instance; a home with a family who's lived there for years would have a very strong one. The threshold in that world doesn't necessarily block bad guys from coming in, but I think the way it works is that if someone's not invited and they have any evil intent, the threshold will make it hard for them to get in, and if they manage it, it'll remove a lot of their power while they're inside. Only works on supernaturals, of course, not humans. So all in all I think the threshold bit only works if someone actually lives there, and if it's, say, an abandoned building a homeless drunk sleeps in now and then, the threshold would be virtually negligible. A business probably wouldn't have much either.

Oh, and other books you should look up--I found these in my werewolf research:
Vampires, Werewolves, and Demons: Twentieth Century Reports in the Psychiatric Literature. Richard Noll.
Mysteries of the Unknown: Transformations. Editors of Time-Life Books.
Adventures in Unhistory: Conjectures on the Factual Foundations of Several Ancient Legends. Davidson, Avram. Also recommended by Neil Gaiman, so, you know.

Ooh, and you should definitely look at tvtropes.org, very addictive site...they'll have a page on vampires in movies and TV.

[faeriemaiden.livejournal.com]

So Christian symbols are used against them for the same reason they'd be used against, say, an actual demon.

That makes sense, especially on the outside of the stories, but I find it weird that nobody ever discusses it within the context of the stories themselves. Other than the whole "Christianity is silly" bias, I suppose. (And Remus is offended, because werewolves generally have no choice in being turned and are often created by accident.)

Now, like Charis said, more modern bits of folklore have focused on the psychic defense raised by the person's faith in the symbol and not the symbol itself.

That's an interesting idea, although it seems too easy to me (and I don't know if I entirely agree with the ideology behind it; bit New Agey) -- I mean, it doesn't make for as good a story, in a way, if anything you happen to feel particularly strongly about can ward off a vampire. Though The Historian, as I recall, had a similar idea, only it wasn't something you could use deliberately, or at close range, more of a general talisman -- the doing of normal things, immersing oneself in some kind of -- interpersonal-ness, or community, or love, it at least kept you a little safer, and my explanation of it was completely rubbish, but there you go.

I really like the threshold concept, and it seems to fit very well with what I know of Evangeline and her universe and the sorts of themes I like to play with, wot.

Yay, researchy books! I tried looking on Amazon for things to get on loan, but Amazon is just too big and full of reviewers with no sense at all; it's impossible to gauge what might be useful and what won't be.

Ooh, and you should definitely look at tvtropes.org, very addictive site...they'll have a page on vampires in movies and TV.

...I would like the last two hours of my life back now. :p